All In: Student Pathways Forward
This podcast focuses on elevating community college student voices to shape inclusive higher education and workforce development policies, practice and partnerships that create economic mobility.
All In: Student Pathways Forward
2022 Oregon Adult Basic Skills Conference: Going the Extra Mile - Live Recording
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This special episode was recorded live at the 2022 Oregon Adult Basic Skills Conference in Salem, Oregon on October 24 organized by the Oregon Higher Education Coordinating Commission. Podcast host Marc Goldberg moderates a panel discussion with Rogue Community College (RCC) student and past GED graduate Lynne Hamblin and Columbia Gorge Community College president Dr. Marta Yera Cronin.
Lynne shares her own journey through the adult education programs at RCC and what supports have been most helpful to her in continuing her education towards a college certificate and degree. Dr. Cronin speaks to the importance of adult education students and programs as core to the mission of community colleges and describes her past work leading and championing adult education programs. Both panelists answer questions from the live audience of over 200 adult education faculty, staff and administrators from the seventeen Oregon community colleges.
The All In: Student Pathways Forward podcast is a part of Oregon’s participation in the National Skills Coalition SkillSPAN network.
Welcome to the All-In Student Pathways Forward Podcast, in which we center Oregon Community College student voices to shape inclusive policies, practice, and partnerships. This is the host, Mark Goldberg, and we have a special episode of the pod today as we recorded this live at the annual Oregon Adult Basic Skills Conference on Monday, October 24th. We have a panel discussion with Rogue Community College student Lynn Hamplin, who's a GED graduate, along with Community College President, Dr. Mark Sakira Cronin. It's a great conversation on all things adult education with a room full of faculty, staff, administrators, and educational partners from across Board. The conversation includes a number of questions from the audience for the guests. It's the perfect venue for the first live recorded all-in podcast as a number of students featured in previous episodes have begun their educational journeys taking adult education coursework. Thanks for listening in. We're looking out on a room of about 200 colleagues who support adult education students in some capacity as faculty, as staff, as educational partners. And so it's wonderful to be here. And I think the theme of the conference, going the extra mile, I can't think of a better way to go the extra mile than to hear from students and hear from executives. So I will introduce our guests leading up to that, but I do want to just thank the Oregon Higher Education Coordinating Commission for this opportunity to do this live broadcast. I want to thank specifically Dr. Adrian Oakes for the invitation and for her leadership for this conference and for supporting adult ed students across the state. So thank you, Dr. Oakes. And I know that Donna Lewelling, the director of the Oregon Department of Community Colleges Workforce Development under the HEC, is here. So thank you, Donna, for your ongoing leadership. And for the whole team from CCWD HEC for sponsoring this conference. It's tremendous. So I'm honored to introduce our guests for this episode. First, to my right is Lynn Hamblin, who is a student from Rogue Community College. Welcome, Lynn.
SPEAKER_08Thank you. Glad to be here.
SPEAKER_05And then to Lynn's right is Dr. Mark DeYra Cronin, the president of Columbia Gorge Community College. Welcome, Dr. Cronin.
SPEAKER_04Thank you.
SPEAKER_05All right, so now we want to get you all warmed up. So gonna ask you a few questions. Who in the room is passionate about adult education student success? All right. I think that's everyone here in whatever capacity you work to support students. I'd like to ask who in the room is a faculty member? All right. How about staff that support students mainly outside the classroom in achieving their goals? Do we have any educational partners in the room here? Got a few? Okay. Uh do we have any students in the room? We have at least one. So let's do this a different way. So who in the room supports uh high school equivalency GED students in some capacity? All right, we got a big crew here. How about ESOL students? All right, Chad in the back. How about students in corrections education programs? See some former colleagues who I know do amazing work with corrections education. Who in the room supports any students that are in integrated education and training programs? All right, so I'll ask one more question. Anyone who's listened to the All in Student Pathways Forward podcast before, give a shout out. Okay. We've got some folks who've listened and hopefully some new listeners. So with that, we'll kick it off with questions for our guests. As the regular podcast format, it always starts with a student, so I'll begin with Lynn and want to ask you, Lynn, if you could share more about your background and journey into the GED program at Rogue Community College.
SPEAKER_08Actually, I grew up in Seattle and I was fourth generation in a family-owned business. And so in my mind, there was no need for college. I had a career, I had a skill set, I didn't need to waste four years of my life and be thousands and thousands of dollars in debt. When I moved to Oregon, my skills came with me, and I worked in a jewelry store in Grants Pass and I loved it. But when I got pregnant and had twins at 37 and could not go back to work because of the cost of daycare, I actually went into really, really deep postpartum that was really affecting my life and my kids' life. And when they went to Head Start, that was actually on the campus, they said, We'll pay for you to get your GED. And I said, Sure, it's something to do. My kids are here anyway. What's the difference? But in one term, it changed my whole life. That was of course was the term before COVID. And so I then spent the next two terms giving up again, and I was not gonna finish, I had to start over, all my tests were canceled. What was the point? But having that one term on campus and making really amazing friends, it was one of those students that made me come back in the fall, and in three terms changed my life, and here I am now.
SPEAKER_05That's great, thank you, Lynn. And I know as we get further along, Lynn will share more of her story, which is incredible, but thanks for sharing how you got into the GED program and started your journey at Rogue Community College. So, Dr. Cronin, I want to ask you before moving to Oregon and becoming the president of Columbia Gorge Community College, you've worked with and been a champion for adult education students and programs. And so I wanted to ask if you could tell us a bit about that past experience and share highlights about Columbia Gorge Community College's adult ed program and why you see it as important to your college's mission.
SPEAKER_07Sure, thank you. So I was the dean of the School of Education at my former institution, right? Teacher education. So when the Dean for Adult Ed left the college, it was like, okay, where do we put adult ed? It's sometimes it's almost like an afterthought, right? And so they said, education, you're the dean of education, adult education, teacher education, sure, you know, we'll put it with you. And I also got developmental education, but that's a topic for another conference. So adult education, I was like, okay, I came from an area where it was all associated in arts degrees and bachelor's degrees. I didn't know the first thing about adult education, but it didn't take me long at all to realize the great things that were going on in adult education. And also they were super underutilized, understaffed, under-resourced, but you know, that again is a topic for a further question later. So for me, it wasn't very difficult to become a champion for adult ed. It was something that I thought, look at these students who are coming to us and need us, possibly, some might say, more than some of the other students do. And here, you know, they're relegated to the, I don't want to say the leftover resources, but maybe not the top-end buildings and the great technology, and what kind of a message does that send to them? So for me, it was all about it's really not fair. Again, I'll tell you a little bit more about that later on. But as a result of that, we developed an institute called the Institute for the Professional Development of Adult Educators, IPDA. Some of you might have heard of it, IPDAE.org. There's all sorts of resources, so go online if you have a moment to take a look. But we wanted to solve the problem in the whole state, not just in our area. So that was just one little thing that we did. But as far as CDCC, our instructors are passionate, as all of you are here, from what I've heard so far today, about what they do. So it's not uncommon to see, you know, an incredible amount of collaboration. The area houses our STEP program, it houses our benefits navigator. So it's not uncommon to see all instructors and employees really working in tandem to guide a single student throughout the process. And that really makes all the difference in the world. And so you asked about our mission, and our mission is to build dreams and transform lives. Talk about an opportunity to transform a life, right? People come to us and they don't even speak the language. And by the way, for those of you who don't speak many foreign languages, English is one of the most difficult languages to learn. So we need to give them the credit for what they do. But it's very easy to transform a life when you know people want to work hard and you have the resources available and you are working there to make it happen. So that is how we transform lives at CGCC.
SPEAKER_05Thank you, Dr. Cronin. And I appreciated all that you said, and in particular, that professional development institute you started, and that was in the state of Florida.
SPEAKER_07Florida, and they've been asked by other states to do trainings, they're still in existence. It was started with a grant, and the Florida DOE saw such value to it that they fund it every year. So it's still in existence. So check out the website, you might be able to benefit from some of the resources.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, thank you. And I hadn't even thought, aside from just the podcast, another resource through your past work in another state. So thank you. So, Lynn, I want to come back to you and ask the GED program at Rogue Community College was the symbolic door where you entered the college, but I know passing the GED was not the ending point. How did the programming at Rogue Community College help you continue your studies and support your career goals beyond the GED?
SPEAKER_08Well, actually, when I first started my first day on my 41st birthday, actually, that was my end goal. I didn't really think that I needed it. It was something to fill time, but I learned very quickly that that was not gonna be the case. And because I was receiving SNAP benefits, I was eligible for the STEP program, which helps support me all the way through my GED and through my college career pathway certificate, and also supported me through concurrent enrollment, which was instrumental to pushing me forward and keeping me going. It paid for all my tuition, it paid for all my books, the STEP program paid for all of my tests. It allowed me to focus on my studies and then not have to worry about the fundamentals of how am I gonna make this happen. So that was really key.
SPEAKER_05So it sounds like the STEP grant and other resources along with a concurrent enrollment, where I've heard you describe this, or you did on the podcast where you were working towards your GED, but then also able to take some credit classes.
SPEAKER_08I took four college-level credited classes while working on my GED, which then um I was all of my prereqs and two of my classes through my certificate when I actually entered college.
SPEAKER_05So that's a fantastic model. And when students are able to accelerate that while they're working on their GED or improving their English language skills, it gets them quicker to goals related to their careers. And also, I've heard other students say it boosts confidence, right? Students can see themselves as a college student because they're taking credit classes.
SPEAKER_08It's definitely built by confidence, absolutely.
SPEAKER_05So, Dr. Cronin, I wanted to ask you how the adult education, pre-college, adult basic skills, however, it's referred to at Columbia Gorge, how adult ed programs at the college align with and support college goals focused on equity and inclusion, as well as guided pathways and efforts to increase college completion and connection to quality jobs. That's a lot in there.
SPEAKER_07So you and I have talked about this before about the need to change the narrative. If someone comes to us, they're not there to pass the GED. What is it that they really want to do? Why is the limitation already placed on them? Chances are they have other goals, but really they're concerned about even passing the GED. So we try to change the narrative, and as an HSI, it's really important. Equity is absolutely at the forefront of everything we do. I mean, these students come to us perhaps a little further behind than our other students and on their pathway, but there's no reason why they can't be on one of those pathways that lead to quality employment in the end. And so our CGCC instructors or our pre-college instructors specifically are in the process of really honing in and defining those pathways and securing the co-enrollment in those programs so that students start early on in their pathway. No one wants to come and take extra classes or be there 10 years for a two-year degree if they don't have to be, right? So if they can get started at the same time, that is really the goal. So we have a bunch of new programs that we started this year, so we're really working on those CTE pathways and that co-enrollment, building sustainable co-enrollment so that students in these GED programs can continue on. And it'll be seamless transition from the day they pass their exam onto their program and through graduation, hopefully.
SPEAKER_05Thanks for sharing that. And as you were commenting there, it just brought me back to past years working at Mount Hood Community College with adult education students and faculty, and remembering when we would ask our students what are your goals, it was probably 90% of the students said to get a job or to get a better job. Right? So all that connected to careers and quality jobs is critical, and again goes back to that acceleration for those technical skills and those foundational skills into those careers. So appreciate you sharing that. I think Lynn, we know many community college students, and especially those in adult education programs, have complex lives and are frequently juggling parenting, work, and many other family and financial responsibilities. I would say adult basic skills, faculty, and staff. So all of you in this room have a great understanding of those realities as well as anyone on campus. And so I want to ask you, you talked a little about the STEP grant. Are there other supports that were most helpful to you when you were in the GED concurrent enrollment program at the college?
SPEAKER_08Yeah, definitely the STEP program was key to my support through the program, but that's just financial, right? So when I began the program, we had two families living in our one home. There were five children in my house, and I missed a lot of school because there was always somebody sick, there was always somebody that needed to go to the doctor, and just everybody on campus, whether it's instructors or the office staff, were more than understanding and helpful to gather homework or help in the study lab if I could miss the morning class but get to study lab and help me study through it. The instructors and the office support were huge. And then, second to that, the amazing group of friends that I made who would gather my homework if I wasn't there, and vice versa, we would help each other, we would meet outside of school and study and work together. Those really intimate personal connections that I made not only with fellow students but also with instructors and staff.
SPEAKER_05So aside from the financial support through the STEP grant and maybe other resources, just the connection with faculty and staff and classmates.
SPEAKER_00Absolutely.
SPEAKER_05So on a related note, Dr. Cronin, we want to talk about the topic of digital equity and know that that's important for students and college faculty and staff as it relates to access, holistic supports, and digital skills, an issue that has only been magnified the past few years during the COVID pandemic. So we have a significant number of faculty here today. Could you describe ways colleges like Columbia Gorge Community College have used or could use technology creatively to enhance instruction and also ways to ensure students have the digital skills and access needed to succeed in college?
SPEAKER_07So being in a rural area, prior to the pandemic, connectivity had been a problem as it was. We had Wi-Fi hotspots, we had Chromebooks for checkout in the library for students who lived in these kinds of areas. And it wasn't until the pandemic that we really realized the magnitude of the problem. So we spent a lot of our relief funding on portable technology, not just for our students, but we found that there were many instructors who lived in remote areas and couldn't access what they needed to access. So we really wanted to focus on making sure students were connected and engaged, making sure faculty were able to teach to the best of their ability given the circumstances, and to make sure that our support staff were able to provide comprehensive resources virtually during the pandemic or when we were not on campus. So our instructors right now, especially our ABS instructors, they are very good about taking the basic platform that we have. We use Moodle, that's our LMS, and supplementing it with lots of technology and lots of different software that really keeps students engaged. We know that we can't count on students, and if you had a child during the pandemic who was going to school, if their lessons weren't engaging, we know that they weren't sitting in front of the computer working and focusing on what they were doing. So for us, it's all about keeping them engaged and finding resources and things that will keep them engaged in a virtual environment. And that is a constant area of discovery for all our faculty, not just our ABS faculty. Although they are as up-to-date as our other faculty are, they have access to the same types of resources because it's really important when you're talking about equity. It doesn't matter what the program is, it doesn't matter how advanced the students are. Everyone should have access to the same resources, and that's what we try to do.
SPEAKER_05Thank you. I think that's worthy of a round of applause, and uh just appreciate that perspective, especially from a college president, and understanding the complexity of digital equity and really supporting all students so that they're set up for success. So, Lynn, want to ask you from a student's perspective, and this is a big question, what advice would you give to ESOL, GED, adult education faculty that are here today in terms of how they can approach instruction in the classroom to create an inclusive learning community?
SPEAKER_08Well, as a student, like especially post-COVID and having come from all those amazing connections with friends, one of the most lonely things was being the only person in Zoom with a camera on. And I find that that was a real struggle for me personally. So I would really that I understand that you can't demand students turn their cameras on, housing insecurities, minor students in foster care or things of those natures. But even encouraging those black cameras to maybe add a picture, whether it's of themselves or maybe something of interest that we can talk about. To have more of inclusion from these little black tiles, I think it creates a little bit more of a personal effect of there is a person behind that black screen. And I think that that is a really important way to make everybody feel included, not just the ones that are willing to turn their cameras on.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, I think that's a great suggestion for classes that are still remote and finding innovative ways to still find connection points for students. Thank you for sharing that. So, Dr. Cronin, this podcast is all about centering student voices. So we know that centering student voices to shape better practice and policy is a valuable student success and equity strategy when we hear from students. We know that many adult education students may not have the bandwidth to add their voice in traditional student leadership activities like the associated student government or maybe some committees that students are on because of their complex lives. So wanted to ask you what are some innovative ways colleges like Columbia Gorge are amplifying student voices, especially our adult education students?
SPEAKER_07So admittedly, I think we have a lot of work to do in this area, but we have no real formal way for our students to give their voices. I mean, open student forums, things of that nature, they can pop in virtually, that's a good way to get them engaged. But we do have a good pulse on what our students need because we know that they talk to the instructors, we know that they're close to the staff. So at any given moment, we know what the predominant challenges are, but as far as a natural formal way for them to be able to contribute. Input, I don't think we have it at the college. We pick them to do some stories online, some testimonials, they're featured in our newsletter that goes out to the community and things like that. But really, an opportunity for them to just talk like that, an open form, would probably be the best way to do that, though. Some of them we know if they're not confident in their English skills, they're not gonna say anything, right? Unless we speak to them in their native language. So those are challenges that we're still working through at the college. And I think I'd welcome opportunities to get some ideas from some of you, but yes, it's still a challenge, and we know that, and we are actively working on getting them to express their experiences because I think it's important not for just us to hear it, I think it's important for other students and other programs across the college to recognize the journeys that their peers have been on that might not have been as smooth as theirs. So I think that that's a really important viewpoint for everyone to be part of and listen to.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, I think that's a really good point, and it also normalizes student experiences, right? And at times and hopefully can destigmatize these resources. So we've heard this from some students on the podcast. They may feel like someone else may need this more. I'm not sure if this is for me, and the more that students are sharing their stories, the more it just becomes common. No different than applying for federal financial aid, that these additional resources are there for students. Coming back to you, Lynn, Dr. Oaks introduced you as both a student and also someone who's working at the campus. So I wanted to ask you to talk about your current work supporting adult education and STEP students on campus and any reflections on how adult education faculty and staff can best support students right now.
SPEAKER_08I think the biggest thing. That I'm hearing, they don't even know they have support. So I say, know what your state and your college has to offer for your students support-wise. I feel completely blessed to be able to be the STEP support person for our students on our college campus, and I can filter all of these supports to them. Like you said, I personally am one of those students that thought that I have a roof over my head, I have food in my mouth, I should not take this from somebody else. But that's not the case. And I think that that stigma needs definitely to be removed from thought from everybody because it was these programs that saved me and saved my career goals and brought me here to share this with all of you. So know your programs and know the supports that are offered.
SPEAKER_05Thank you. That's wonderful advice and really critical. So I appreciate you sharing that. Dr. Cronin, I got the chance to speak with you on a past podcast episode that featured a Columbia Gorge Community College graduate. And when we were talking, and this student was not an adult education student, so I'll preface it there, unsolicited, you brought up the importance of adult education and just music to my ears, and was thrilling to hear that from a college president. And know that there are other college presidents in Oregon who also are amazing champions for our students. This is a bit of a loaded question, so I'm putting Dr. Conan on the spot here. But I know, having worked at community colleges, that because of the students that we serve, that our programs may be non-credit or they may be pre-college level, that at times some folks may not see them as a priority. And that's not our reality. Our students are the most amazing, hardworking, dynamic students that I know. But wanted to ask you, what would you say to someone who didn't believe adult education students should be a priority because they're non-credit or because they're picking, say, pre-college level courses?
SPEAKER_07So simply said, I would say revisit the mission of the community college. Right. Students come to us for opportunity. It doesn't matter where they are on that pathway. These students might need more resources, they might need a little more extra attention, but so what? Isn't that what we're here for? I mean, to provide opportunity to everyone, regardless of whether they are at the beginning or towards the end of their programs. Now, if we're just looking at the bottom line on the spreadsheet, shame on us. And I know it's important to look at those numbers, but the numbers we should be looking at are the impact. What kind of an impact are we having on our students? Are they out there in the workforce? Are they earning decent wages? How are we transforming their lives? And really the diversity that they bring to our campus, you know, not just ethnic and racial, but because of their experiences. I mean, how does that not enrich the college experience for everyone who is on campus? I mean, as a first generation college student, my entire generation was not born in this country. I have siblings who were not born here, I have cousins who were not born here, and had it not been for these kinds of opportunities, they would not have had access to their version of the American dream. So how can we ever really, in good conscience, deny anybody that opportunity who really wants it and comes to us for help?
SPEAKER_05So I'll just say we're super fortunate to have you as a champion in Oregon as one of our 17 community college presidents with that perspective and values. So thank you for that and for sharing that. So, Lynn, there are a few hundred Oregon adult education faculty and staff here today and tomorrow for this conference. What's the most important policy or practice recommendations that you would like them to bring back to their institutions to best support our students in achieving their academic and career goals?
SPEAKER_08I'm sure most of you, very much like my own instructors, are so encouraging, I had walked into a classroom after almost 30 years of being out of one. And my second grade teacher told me every day that I was stupid because I couldn't do math. And I carried that with me for most of my life. And so to be in a room where people cared so much, and actually led me to believe that I am more and that I'm worth more, that's huge. That's what changes life. And I hope that you guys really all do that with your students because I know mine did for me. I can't even read my note cards now. And then I think another key thing is when we see our students that are in crisis, if we cannot help them, carry them to the people that they can, help them share their story. Because no student wants to have to share their pain more than once, really. So if you can help with that burden, lessen that burden for them, that will also resonate with you.
SPEAKER_05Thank you, Lynn. And so I don't think Lynn shared this on stage, but she shared with us during lunch that her adult education faculty members are here from Rogue Community College who encouraged her, who she's talking about now. So round of applause for them. I'm not sure if they want to do that.
SPEAKER_08If uh Lori Lund and Christy Kalowski could please stand up so everybody can recognize you.
SPEAKER_05That's awesome. Thank you for sharing that, Lynn, and for sharing your story and also that point which is so important too of not making students become re-traumatized in retelling their story, or also, in some cases, performing their poverty. Our students should be able to answer questions and get the resources they need immediately. And that takes all of us understanding the complex web of resources within the college and even outside with partner agencies, and that's always changing too. So it's a really valuable recommendation. Thank you. Dr. Cronin, the same question back to you as a college president. What recommendations would you offer this amazing group of dedicated faculty and staff to bring back to their institutions and supporting and advocating for adult education students?
SPEAKER_07The number one thing I would tell you to do is to educate. So when I moved into the role of Dean of Adult Education at my former institution, after having been there for 11 years as a faculty member and department chair, I knew very little about what went on in that building. I knew they had GED and they had ESOL there. And other than that, I knew nothing. So that is shameful, really. As a faculty member on that campus, I should have known whether or not I was in that program. So, much to the dismay of a lot of people, I became an advocate on campus for adult ed, and I made sure to tell everybody about all the great things that were happening. Two buildings away from you. You don't know that? You have no idea how many students have come to your programs that have gone through that building and gone through those instructors. You need to know what is on your campus. So every opportunity we had, we presented, we let everybody know because you know what? The more voices you have advocating with you, the better off you'll be. So my number one thing, educate, and the number two thing is advocate. And then you have all those extra people joining you in that advocacy. It's powerful and it's really important because I guarantee you, no matter how small your campus is, the details of all the work and all the passion that goes into what you do is not well known. So I recommend that you get out there and you tell people till they're tired of hearing from you about how great your students are, how hard they work, and how you could probably use more resources in your areas.
SPEAKER_05Thank you. Educate and advocate. And we could have a whole nother episode on strategies of doing that, but I've seen two, and would imagine from your perspective, that can be with data in terms of demographics and outcomes, and then it's always stories, right? Stories make a difference. And that's a great way to wrap up, as that's really the purpose of this podcast. So I just want to thank our two guests, Lynn and Dr. Cronin, for answering questions, for sharing your experience as a student and as a college president and a champion, and also sharing your insights and recommendations to the audience here. So let's give them a round of applause. And we do have time for questions. So Aaron and Deborah have microphones. So if you have a question that you'd like to ask Dr. Cronin or Lynn, please feel free to raise your hand and we'll get mics to you quickly.
SPEAKER_00Hi. Lynn, you had mentioned and talked about the importance of students knowing the supports that are available to them. As an educator, especially a math educator, what advice do you have on how I can encourage that with my students and guide them to that, particularly when the classroom is the only time that I see them, but I want to be able to help them reach those supports. What advice would you have for me doing that?
SPEAKER_08I find out who those people are on your campus, invite them into your classroom. Have them come talk directly to the students so they can share their passion for their own programs.
SPEAKER_01Hi, it's nice to see both of you again. So I'm the State Director for Adult Basic Education for the State, and so I actually have a question about how can we at the state help change the narrative about who the students that we are serving, and how do we change the narrative about the fact that they are capable of truly achieving really big things? What can we do at the state to change that narrative?
SPEAKER_07We need a statewide campaign that focuses just on students that have come through these programs. Them telling their stories occasionally they'll go to the legislature and contribute, but I think that we need something focused solely on them because sometimes they get lost when you've got other students and other programs in the glamour of another program that might be more popular or needed in the state. Just bring me with you, Donna.
SPEAKER_08We'll go.
SPEAKER_05And if I could add to, it's been really interesting through this podcast to speak with students at different phases in their journey. So it's incredible to have a student who's completed ESOL or GED coursework, then gone on and gotten a college credential and are now working and can talk about the value of that education starting in adult education, and then to even hear what they're doing with their employment and how that's impacted their family, but then also to hear students who started in GED, ESOL and now are in, say, a CTE program and are on their way, have clear goals and know what they need to do and have had success and maybe getting a stackable credential first and they're continuing on. It just seems like at all those stages, they're all incredible stories. I don't know, sometimes it feels like we want to get that success story of the student that's all the way at the finish line, and it doesn't have to be because our students have such incredible stories and insights wherever they're at in their journey, particularly those that started in adult education programs. And I'll just go back because I know that was Donna Lewelling, and I know Donna you introduced yourself by title, but just wanted to get your name too. Thank you for the question.
unknownSo nervous.
SPEAKER_04Do you guys, I know everyone comes from different colleges, but what does graduation for GED students look like at your institutions? I know that some people may feel like it takes away from the college graduates when they're getting their associates or whatever, and I've run across that a couple times. So is graduation for your GED students as much of a production as other graduations.
SPEAKER_07We even highlight during our regular commencement a GED speaker. For us, it's the same, right? They're part of the ceremony like everybody else's.
SPEAKER_08Well, I know that this past year was the first year that GED students we were able to commence in person. Our college for associates' degrees and other pathways did a commencement, and they all drove through and we screamed and we yelled, and it was great fun. When that was over, we walked our GED students in robes and caps through where the cars had gone with all the college departments screaming and yelling and making a big to-do. And we did have two student speakers this year. I know the past years, because of COVID, we've not been able to, and I know before COVID that it was its own graduation and its own big to-do.
SPEAKER_05So is it okay if I brag on Lynn a little bit? Because she hasn't shared this yet, and I consider her a friend now as I've gotten to know her. So Lynn didn't share that when she completed her first college credential uh career pathway certificate, that you were a speaker.
SPEAKER_08I was the student speaker for my graduating class that we didn't get graduation but through Zoom, so I went and recorded my speech. So yeah.
unknownAwesome.
SPEAKER_05And uh I don't want to take over too much time, but just looking around the room and seeing past colleagues from colleges that I've worked at. So I know Mountain Hood Community College would do a big GED graduation separately, and I just have memories of seeing not just parents and grandparents, but actually children and grandchildren supporting their family members who got their GED. And it was as meaningful as the college commencement for graduates of certificates degrees. And then seeing some corrections education colleagues from Coffee Creek, where got the chance in a former role to speak at some of the GED graduations and seeing family members of the students, adults in custody being there to cheer on their family members, super powerful. And one last quick thing that I know colleges have done for anyone involved in IET programs, integrated education and training that may have GED, ESOL, traditional students, developmental ed students. We used to do a separate graduation. We would invite an employer to talk who'd hired graduates of the program, so you got an employer perspective, always family and friends. And then we also invited an elected official. So we would invite the mayor or a county commissioner, and it was just a great way to build that awareness and advocacy outside the college, right? Because now you have a city council, county commissioner getting to hear two or three students describe their experience. And students, again, that people don't necessarily imagine because they think of traditional high school graduates in many cases, hearing their story, seeing their family there. So that was just a powerful way to help others in the community, policymakers, understand the power of these programs.
SPEAKER_02I was wondering, Dr. Cronin, if you could give some ideas of how faculty, teaching faculty, can actually bring awareness to our department, or is that just up to our supervisors who have direct connections with people of your position? How can we showcase our departments?
SPEAKER_07So I used to I signed us up for everything. I signed us up for instructional council meetings when the faculty met, I signed us up for professional day for the faculty in service. Any occasion where people from the college were coming together, that's when we're making these presentations and letting them know what it is that we're doing in our areas. And if possible, you can bring a student along with you, they like to hear from students as well. But we went back looking in the database to see which students from GED went onto programs, and we went to those faculty. Hey, did you know that so-and-so who graduated last year from your program was a GED student? And a lot of times they didn't even know. So that helps them make the connection, it helps them pay closer attention in the future to students who might be coming from GED programs.
SPEAKER_06Good afternoon. I heard a few uh items, a few pieces of information that I've been waiting to hear for a very long time. And thank you for those of you uh on the panel and with uh all in student pathways forward. I think for too many years, ABS and GED in many departments and many institutions has been a backroom that folks don't know how to get to. My question to you, Dr. Cronin and others, uh what do we need to do to start this campaign in Oregon to bring ABS and GED to the forefront? Because for decades, and maybe ever since its creation, it has not been at the forefront where it needs to be in general.
SPEAKER_07So at my former institution, we were in portables until we actually had our own building. So it's not uncommon, right? I think that what we need to do is we need to, like I said, launch a campaign. I think that if we dug deeply, we'd find out that some people in prominent positions in our state, local business owners or people in the legislature, might have gone through GED. I mean, I think that more people than we know actually have been through your programs and they could be spokespeople for your programs. I think that people sometimes they don't see the finish line. Great, you graduated all these people in GED. Where are they now? If we can show where they've been and we have people coming back, I think that the more we keep at the forefront, the more attention we'll get. You know, sometimes we do something, oh, and then that's it. Then you don't hear any more about it for a while. So I think it needs to be not necessarily in your face, but steady. Steady so that the message is repeated and repeated and repeated until people hear it in their sleep and actually try to do something about it. I think that that's all we can do. Because if you're too much in people's faces, that could be off-putting, right? But I think that steady messaging is really what we need to get into people's ears and get on their minds and get on their bills or anything else that we feel that we might need to move forward.
SPEAKER_08Continual, I think, is a good way to put it. Yes. So maybe like once a year we can just have like a statewide I'm a GED graduate party day. See, that's too intermittent.
SPEAKER_07So you have to have this cadence, cadence of getting in people's ears and expressing what you're doing and showing off the great things that are happening.
SPEAKER_05If I could add a little bit, I think that's such an important question. And I feel like, at least from my own experience as an administrator for adult ed, it has seemed like understanding what the priorities are at the institution and making sure we align with them and have the right sort of framing. So if the college, as all of our colleges are committed to equity, diversity, equity, and inclusion, then at one of the institutions I worked at, we gathered the data and showed the demographics of our students relative to the whole institution. When it was about or has been about guided pathways, the college had a great image of guided pathways in the meta-majors, and we grabbed it and we put adult debt in the middle. Like we can be in the middle of guided pathways, and then we've got bridge programs into an IET, and so just understanding what I think the priorities are at institutions and demonstrating how our students fit and align with that.
SPEAKER_07So to Mark's point, it's really important that it never be perceived credit versus non-credit, right? We're all one working towards the same goal to get students out there into quality employment opportunities. So the more we align, the better off we'll be, which is why it's so important to bring along the entire campus, not just your departments.
SPEAKER_02So to be very specific, in order to have that person who maybe collects data or tracks where have our students gone after they got their GED, that's gonna take man hours, that's gonna take funding. My perception just as a faculty member is a lot of times it's like, we'll go get a grant for that. You know, that's not gonna come from the college, I sometimes feel. So what would be the best way to tap into or to justify that that's worth funds that come into our program to support staff to do that tracking?
SPEAKER_07So I don't know that we'll be able to justify it till we actually show the numbers. I think we all know that the numbers are there, we just need to put them together. And I think maybe that goes back to Donna's original question: how can the state help? Maybe that's how they can help related to what it is that we're doing. Help us figure out how do we get this data, how do we put it together, what's the narrative that goes with the data to support us and our programs?
SPEAKER_05So all the colleges have a Title II grant, and one of the outcomes is transition to post-secondary education. So I think sitting down with the institutional research folks, if you're able, and saying, we've got a federal grant, we need to be able to demonstrate this, we need the data.
unknownDr.
SPEAKER_03Crony made a comment just a moment ago about kind of the distinction between credit bearing and non-credit programs, which is where GED instruction currently lies. And as a GED instructor myself, I think about the many barriers that our graduates face in continuing their education. So I'm curious to know what would it take, but also what do community colleges really risk if we were able to provide credit for students while they are pursuing their GED?
SPEAKER_08That's a great question. I feel like I'm a living testament to that question, though. By having with your co-enrollment. Yeah, with my concurrent enrollment, I took four college-level accredited classes while working on my GED. And it it made me realize I was capable and I could do more, and I could get a college degree. So I think it's instrumental for these programs, and it may not be for every student, but at least having them available is key.
SPEAKER_05Appreciate the question, and we are gonna wrap up here. First, I want to thank our guests again, Lynn and Dr. Cronin, for being on the panel and answering questions as part of this podcast episode. Let's give them another round of applause. Um I also want to thank all of you for being here and being an active audience for this first live episode. So give yourself a round of applause as well.
SPEAKER_07And to our host, Mark Goldberg. Thank you.
SPEAKER_05Thank you. And also just one last uh round of applause to the Higher Education Coordinating Commission and Dr. Oaks for the invitation to do a live episode and to get to hear from Lynn, an amazing student and a college president who clearly is a great champion for our students and programs. So thank you again. That'll do it for this special version of the All In Student Pathways Force podcast. This is the host, Mark Goldberg, and we'll be back soon with a regular episode featuring an Oregon community college graduate now working in a quality job. Thanks again for listening in.