All In: Student Pathways Forward
This podcast focuses on elevating community college student voices to shape inclusive higher education and workforce development policies, practice and partnerships that create economic mobility.
All In: Student Pathways Forward
Lane Community College & NCTN/World Education - Student Maria Cristina Cruz & College President Dr. Margaret Hamilton; NCTN/World Education, Inc Senior Technical Advisor Judy Mortrude
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This episode features Lane Community College (LCC) student Maria Cristina Cruz, who is enrolled in an innovative Early Childhood Education program that integrates Career Technical Education coursework with foundational skills leading to a college credential. Cristina is a parenting student who has found employment in her field of study while still in school and has accessed different resources at LCC to make it all work.
Lane Community College President Dr. Margaret Hamilton shares her enthusiasm and commitment to the statewide Pathways to Opportunity framework as a racial equity strategy and discusses the importance of the Navigator role to help students maximize benefits to complete college.
Judy Mortrude, Senior Technical Advisor at National College Transitions Network/World Education, Inc, talks about the importance of adult integrated education and training career pathways programs, like the PASS Lane Early Childhood Education program at LCC, and how these efforts are part of the federal Workforce Innovation and Opportunity Act (WIOA) of 2014 and fit in with broad college-wide Guided Pathways initiatives.
Welcome to the All First Student Pathways 4 podcast, where we're focused on elevating student voices from working students and colleges to take inclusive policy programs and partnerships. This is Mark Golbert, the host, and I'm very happy to have the topic and work from working out as well as other five. And after that, I'll speak with Like Alexis, Dr. Margaret Hamilton, reflecting back on the interview with Christina, talking about the college's involvement in the state white TPO and the five. And lastly, I'll talk with Doctor Warcher from World Education about innovative adult education career pathways programs and related policies. Thanks for listening in and hope that you enjoyed this episode. I'd like to introduce Maria Christina Cruz to the podcast today. She is a student at Lane Community College in Eugene, Oregon. Welcome Christina to the podcast.
SPEAKER_03Thank you.
SPEAKER_01Appreciate you taking time to have a conversation today.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, you're welcome. It's my pleasure to be here with you guys.
SPEAKER_01So what I'd like to do first is just ask you, Christina, if you could talk about your background and your journey to Lane Community College as a student.
SPEAKER_03Well, I always wanted to come back to go to school, but uh since I have two daughters and work, it was difficult. But I found a job in a preschool as a substitute teacher, and then they hired me as a bilingual aide, and then I find out that if I go back to school to the EC program, I can apply for the position as a teacher. So I enroll myself to uh to college now that my daughters are grown up and I'm here, and it's exciting.
SPEAKER_01That's great. And when you talk about the EC program, that's their early childhood program?
SPEAKER_03Early childhood education program.
SPEAKER_01Education program, ECE. Okay. How did you find your way into their early childhood field uh when you began working?
SPEAKER_03Well, I know this program for a long time, and when I had this opportunity to apply, I say that's what I want to do, and I'm gonna try and I go ahead and now the classes. So yeah, I um signed this uh past lane program. This is a support class. So they have been helping me step by step in the program. So I'm there.
SPEAKER_01Well, that's helpful to hear, and we'll talk a little bit more in a bit about the past program. Before we do, I'm wanted to ask you from your experience, what has been your biggest success so far in your experience as a student at Lane Community College?
SPEAKER_03I think the support from uh the program and also working in the field. You know, the course at the ACC, I applied for the teaching position and I got accepted. And now I'm happy for that because I'm uh working towards the certificate, but also I have a job already. So I believe that that is the biggest success. Uh, now that the pandemic hit and everything, they closed the school and they needed an interpreter while I was, you know, working from home. They asked me if I can do that job too. And I said, yes, of course. So now they asked me if I can get this position permanent, and I got that job, which is good. Better because it's something that I wanted to do too. I love being in the classroom, I love being, you know, near the uh children and interact. But what I'm doing is beyond like uh social service with the family. So I'm happy that I got hired permanently for this position.
SPEAKER_01That's great. Congratulations.
SPEAKER_03Thank you.
SPEAKER_01Already being a worker, to me, it seems like the opportunity to take coursework and then immediately apply those skills to your work is really a valuable experience.
SPEAKER_03Yes, it's kind of like a fast track in learning because you you learn something and you apply right away. So it was very helpful having learned a lot in the classes and helped me in my position too. So being in college is I feel blessed that you came back and I don't regret it. I know sometimes it's hard because being a mother and a student, if I had to work full-time uh remotely. Yeah, uh, one of the challenges is like how to manage being a parent as a single parent mother is challenging to be raising teenager and also uh manage a full-time job. And um, the hard part of what I'll say and it's very challenging, is by the end of the day when I have to do my homework, and I'm very tired, like it physically and mentally. And sometimes I say, Oh my god, I don't think I can make it today. But what I do is I just take a nap, quick nap, and rest and get up and do my homework, stay up late. But those are, I can say, the challenges is to just juggling, like work, take care of my family, and also work in my studies. But you can do it if you really want to.
SPEAKER_01Well, it sounds like you found a good strategy of just taking a quick break, resting, and then going back at it. But that is a long day to juggle all of that.
SPEAKER_03Yes, and that really helps me uh because I get tired and I say, I don't think I can I can do my homework. So I say, what should I do? Uh drink a coffee or something else, but not always uh helped me.
SPEAKER_01Well, thanks for sharing that that strategy. It is a good one. Yes. So we hear from students all the time that funding college can be a real source of stress. And I'm curious if there have been resources with Lane Community College or outside the college that have been helpful to you in addressing the costs of college.
SPEAKER_03Yes, I think financial always is a stressor. I think that they will be number one. One of the reasons that I didn't come back to school is because I didn't have money to pay my studies and be working at the same time. Uh, one of the resources that I have found in Lane is a scholarship in grants, that is very helpful. And outside the college, also my work can also help me pay my tuition. So that is uh very helpful. I asked for help in my work and they said yes. But since I already have a scholarship, it wasn't necessary. But that is a big help for me.
SPEAKER_01If you have an employer that would be willing to support employees investing in education and training, that's even better if there's not scholarships and other resources available.
SPEAKER_02Yes.
SPEAKER_01So it's nice to hear that they were willing to do so if needed.
SPEAKER_03Yes, they they are. So I really like my job.
SPEAKER_01Um, can I ask you uh if you're connected with the Step Grant?
SPEAKER_03Yes, they do uh also help with trainings. Right now I'm taking some uh credits and trainings, and uh they pay for my trainings that I'm getting. So I can get more credits and graduate faster.
SPEAKER_01So through the PASS program, the STEP grant is also uh a support that's made it easier. Yes. Has there been someone on campus who's helped you to navigate these different benefits and get connected with resources? And if so, uh Christina, how were they most helpful?
SPEAKER_03Uh yes, they have been helping me. There's someone that uh and the program, the STEP uh program, call it more PASS program, they guide us since the beginning of the term, how we can have access to the local resources and all the benefits. They have been helpful with me, like for the trainings. Uh, they paid for my trainings, and it's uh very helpful. Also, uh recently they paid for my internet bill. It was uh really helpful for me because I didn't pay it last month and they offered to pay that. So I was like surprised how far they go to support us, and I appreciate that.
SPEAKER_01So it sounds like those resources that are available through STEP are flexible to accommodate what different students' needs may be, if it's internet costs, particularly when there's a lot of virtual instruction.
SPEAKER_03Yes.
SPEAKER_01Um, but it could be other things as well.
SPEAKER_03Yes, also I have to mention that uh I totally forgot that they pay our class, this class they pay full amount, and it was very helpful for me because so I had to get the extra uh money. And you know, it's a lot of money to you just get paid, and I appreciate that. It has been very helpful.
SPEAKER_01Has that made it easier then for you to continue your coursework at the college?
SPEAKER_03Oh yes, definitely. As a single mother is a lot of expensive and things I have to pay off, and um with you know, this help is is great. It just makes it easier. Uh, and I don't know how I couldn't go on uh without the STEP program without that support.
SPEAKER_01Well, that's great to hear. You talked earlier about the PASS program at Lane, and that's a unique program that the college offers. Could you describe a little bit more in detail what the PASS program is?
SPEAKER_03Uh yes, a STEP PASS program is a support class uh that helps students. We can say students that they're coming back uh to school for 20 years or 10 and they they don't know how to start. And they also help you navigate all the resources or how to do how to start classes from um help you with homework, explain to you in a deeper level that will be just in class. Uh so we have like Zoom classes and any question that will answer. Also uh support different backgrounds, students for with different backgrounds, and that helps a lot. You know, my first language is Spanish. English is my second language, so for me it's a little bit harder to do uh the school to college level, and this class have been helpful uh for me because they explain it like in details when you don't understand, sometimes three or four times. And it makes it clear, makes it easier for me to understand everything.
SPEAKER_01Sounds like the past program is Lane's version or a version of IET integrated education and training. So it couples the early childhood education coursework that you're taking with some additional foundational support if it's writing skills, different academic skills, study skills, so students can work on both while they're working towards a college certificate or degree.
SPEAKER_02Yes.
SPEAKER_01And that model has worked for you.
SPEAKER_03It does. I in the beginning I didn't know exactly what it was, and I said, Oh, maybe it's just, you know, another class and they probably are gonna help me, but it's not gonna be like very helpful. But then I the more I uh go to classes and I see how helpful have been, and makes it easier for me to still uh stay in my classes and in top of everything. And I get good grades because they help me a lot. I don't know if I would have got the same grades that I have now without the help.
SPEAKER_01So it sounds like some supplementary assistance for your early childhood education coursework has made a difference.
SPEAKER_03Definitely.
SPEAKER_01So we know from a national survey from the Hope Center, which is out of Temple University, that uh 63% of community college students across Oregon experience basic needs insecurity. And this is a result of failed systems and policies that have really not kept up with today's college students. But we also hear from students that they're hesitant to seek help or access benefits that they're eligible for because they are concerned that they may be taking those benefits away from another individual who needs them more or because of the stigma associated with them. I'm wondering if you could talk at all about what we can do as college leaders to reduce the stigma and increase the number of students who were accessing the benefits and resources they deserve and need.
SPEAKER_03From my experience, well, I always read all the information about the resources that can have access, and I read everything, the requirement and everything. If I know that uh I qualify, I go for it without any fear or anything because I know that that's gonna help me. And I know that it's made up for us, people that need support. And I will advise you know, students or whoever need the help that go for it because those resources are available for us and they're made for us, and uh, they shouldn't be afraid to apply or to go for it because I'm taking advantage of that, and if the college offers help to especial students that they need that, you should go for it. Sometimes it can be culture too, or the background. Sometimes I speak for my culture because sometimes we we think, no, I I can do it myself, I don't need help, or they feel bad because they're gonna get help, public help. And you know, they shouldn't be ashamed.
SPEAKER_01Um appreciate your perspective on that question and the approach that you've taken in consideration. And uh what I'm hearing you say is students should explore and pursue any and all resources that are gonna help them to be successful, understanding there may be differences in culture, but that your approach has been to go for it. That's sort of your words, just to go for it.
SPEAKER_03They go for it. Also, one of the things that I will say about the colleges, the people who are putting this effort to help and support students, is to when you send the resources out there, send a clear message, and how do I say they explain it in the way that will make the student to go for it? Like uh, how do I say without any um restrictions? Because sometimes there's things that help the resources, but they have a lot of restrictions, you know what I mean? They have requirements, they sometimes um they don't make the student or the person to go for it because they say, okay, there's a 10 list of restrictions.
SPEAKER_01That's really insightful. What I'm hearing you say is like make it as simple as possible. By making it simple, more students will take the time to apply, or and also having a staff person or a faculty who's encouraging students to pursue any and all of these resources can make a difference. So the simplicity and the encouragement are two ways colleges can help students.
SPEAKER_03Yes, you gotta describe those words. I didn't find those words that you wanted to talk about.
SPEAKER_01So, Christina, you've talked about the challenges that you faced in going to school as a single mom, juggling work, family responsibilities in school. From your perspective, what type of college policies could make it easier for students like you to really succeed with their education?
SPEAKER_03I mean, they already have some good ones. Like when you go to college, you have to find a person who guides you the whole process, but also to facilitate, we can say if we have a parent with young children to facilitate to have a childcare that's provided for these parents. That uh I will say no cost because it will be an extra. Also the flexibility in classes. I almost finished my certification, but there's classes also that they're not offered, we can say in summer, they're not offered in the time that I wanted to take it. So I have to wait one year. So that flexibility for us will be helpful with parents like me and students like me.
SPEAKER_01You've offered some additional ones to consider with child care considerations for parents, student parents, as well as flexibility in when courses are offered that uh would make it easier for student parents or working students to uh be able to enroll in the classes that they need for. So on a similar note, uh what is the most important thing that educators, career coaches, and others working to help students succeed can do to help, in particular for non-native English speaking students?
SPEAKER_03One of the things that I will say is to understand students' culture and background and not only to listen, but to put attention on what they have to say, uh suggestions, ideas, and to put it to work. I know that their surveys or a platform like this is really um great because I can speak up and say how I feel about the programs. This is a great opportunity for me. I will say to know better the students is important to know the background so you can understand um where they're coming from and how you can help.
SPEAKER_01So having culturally responsive instructors and and staff who are able to work uh effectively with diverse student populations and have an interest in understanding the variety of cultures that and backgrounds that students have and incorporating that into their instruction and their support.
SPEAKER_03Exactly.
SPEAKER_01I think that's great advice and appreciate you you sharing it.
SPEAKER_03Thank you.
SPEAKER_01So that's advice for college faculty and staff. What advice would you give to other students at Lane or at other community colleges from your own experience?
SPEAKER_03About going to college?
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_03Ah, I think they should go for it. Um and they don't need to think and wait longer. Um, I don't think it's is gonna be a perfect time. Uh as long as you want it, you just go and roll uh and go to college. I think education is always powerful. Since I was a little girl, I always wanted to go to school. And when I uh graduate from high school, I I wanted to be a lawyer. And for some reason, you know, when you're young, sometimes you don't make good decisions. But I came back to college and I feel happy, I feel great, uh, love to achieve goals, and you learn a lot. There's a lot of things that I learned in this class that I never knew. Like it, oh my gosh, like it's amazing in the program that I am. Early childhood education. It's fascinating to know like how the brain works, how children behave, why. It's just fascinating. I love being in school. It's hard, but it's worth it.
SPEAKER_01That's fantastic. I can hear you. Your big passion for your career field. So, how has your experience at Lane Community College, Christina, been been impactful in your life?
SPEAKER_03Yes, I would say even though I haven't finished, I already feel like it's an access because I got the job that I want it and I get more paid also. It's a big responsibility, but I'm happy when I'm at and I'm gonna continue until I'm done with um my career, but having learned a lot more than I thought I was learned. So I feel successful already.
SPEAKER_01Well, congratulations on your journey to this point in getting that job, and good luck as you continue your studies and your career in a really exciting field in early childhood education. I just want to thank you for taking the time to have this conversation for the podcast. Know you have a lot on your plate, but it it is really meaningful, and I've gained a lot from our conversation. So thank you very much, Christina.
SPEAKER_03You're welcome. My pleasure, and it's an honor to be here and to, you know, to speak up, to to say raise my voice and also share my experience, and it's a pleasure.
SPEAKER_01I'd like to welcome my next guest to this podcast episode, Dr. Margaret Hamilton, the president of Lane Community College in Eugene, Oregon. So welcome, Dr. Hamilton, to the All-In Student Pathways Forward podcast.
SPEAKER_00Oh, thank you, Mark, so much for having me today.
SPEAKER_01I wanted to ask you if you could first share a bit more about Lane Community College for listeners that may not be familiar with the institution.
SPEAKER_00Oh, happy to. So, Lane Community College, we're a multi-campus institution and we serve all of Lane County from Florence at the coast, over the mountain range, through rural Oregon, through the valley, and then up the Mackenzie River. And we're the size of Connecticut.
SPEAKER_02Wow.
SPEAKER_00So we're a big college, over 20,000 students, non-credit and credit, come through our doors over five different locations. What's most interesting, I think, about our campus, though, is the campus locations are so diverse. So we've got a campus at the coast, a campus at the airport, down in Cottage Grove, which is very rural. And then we've got the urban campus, right? And then the main suburban campus. So it's it's quite a busy little shop. Over half of our students are Pell students, Pell oriented, and then 55% of them are the first in their family to go to college. So that gives you a little bit of a picture of their socioeconomic status.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, that's really helpful and just fascinating with the geography in terms of the size and the diversity of covering a region that is all of those urban, rural, and in between. So I believe you had the chance to hear the conversation I had with Christina Cruz, who's a student at Lane Community College. And I was wondering what your overall reactions were to that discussion earlier in this podcast episode.
SPEAKER_00I can't thank you enough for doing this. To a president, first of all, it's humbling because to hear how hard our students work, every president needs to hear this a lot. This is something we need to hear. Very proud. I felt so proud of her to hear how far she's come and how Lane, this program at Lane did indeed transform her life. I was happy because it makes me happy to know, you know, you can work really hard and you don't get the outcome. But it's nice to see that a program like this is getting the outcome. And then affirming there is just no better validation than to hear that your programs and services are indeed working. And then, of course, it was so motivating and inspiring to me because as a president, my job is to find funding to keep these programs alive and to promote them like we're doing today.
SPEAKER_01That's great. So, did you hear anything from the conversation with Christina that highlighted work that Lane Community College is doing well to address students' unmet financial needs?
SPEAKER_00It really did. And that was so key to me because you know you can put a lot of programs out there, financial resources, but we all need to hear what is working, what are students taking advantage of. So, first of all, she said right out front that she is working, when she was so proud, so proud she's working. And then, as if that wasn't enough, but I'm working in my field. She was ecstatic. I call that a double bonus. Not only did she get a job, but she got a job, and she said this in a place where she could apply what she was learning. I said, you know, we could put her on a billboard because that's everybody's dream for a teacher, right? That they would apply that learning. So obviously, getting the job helps. Then foundation scholarships. You know, Lane has a wonderful foundation, and they give out about a million dollars a year in scholarships. And this in particular shows that students can come in any door, right, every level, and these scholarships are available to them. She talked a lot about employer tuition reimbursement. And that was just music to my ears because one of the things I'm trying to do is to get more employers in Lane County to use tuition reimbursement. I mean, I can't think of a better way to keep an employee motivated and happy. And she specifically said they're paying for some of my credit courses. I thought it was lovely. She referenced the Steph Grant helping to pay for some of those credits. And, you know, one of the things she inferred, but she didn't really spell it out, was she's actually working in a track to get credits for prior learning, which is so important, especially for these non-traditional students who've been working in the field, who are out there doing things. So she's working in childcare. And at points along the way, she's accumulating skills and time, which will equate to credit. Once she has those credits, that's saving her time on task and ultimately money. The navigators are helping her work it so that if she doesn't need this, then she can not use that money. Let somebody else use that pot of money and then use the other pot. So it's really great to hear her talk about it.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, and to describe how the navigator and the staff are helping her maximize those resources and that credit for prior learning that you touched on is such a valuable strategy for returning students who are working. From the discussion I had with her, did you hear anything that could illuminate a new opportunity for the college that does support student success and especially for adult students like Christina?
SPEAKER_00To me, the magic is in the navigator position. Because heard her constantly talk about how if it wasn't for the people at Lane, you know, the faculty, the coaches, everybody to help put it all together, she wouldn't have been able to do it by herself. It's complicated. So moving to the next step of PTO at Lane Community College, to me, based on what I heard her say, she has inspired me to make sure that we create a support staff that can help these students even more.
SPEAKER_01That's wonderful to hear that. That's a takeaway and priority as it relates to pathways to opportunity, the PTO framework. And I guess thing there, I wanted to ask how you see this pathways to opportunity initiative as a racial equity strategy and how it aligns with your priorities for the college focused on student success.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, that's it's so relevant. PTO is about equity because we are attracting students of all races, all socio and economic statuses, all different life experiences. You know, years and years ago I taught home health aid and I saw what these students needed to just do their work. You know, they need Wi-Fi, they need to be food secure, housing secure. I think a lot about Maslow's theory when I think about PTO. You just have to have your basics needs met before you can move up to a higher level of consciousness and learning. And that's really what's going on. You know, if they're worried about their kids not having adequate childcare, they're hungry, right? They don't have clothes on their back. How on earth can they study? So we are lifting them up. That's the way I look at it. When you think about all the various programs like Pass Lane, Bessel, IBES, they're contextual, right? So they they do accelerated learning. You know, years ago, we called everything pre, prerequisites, pre. You know what we did? We built like a little empire before you even got to college, and those poor students would surf around and around. They never got to the first day of the credit program. Now, for the first time, we can align them more like a co-requisite and accelerate them through. And you know what? Not only do they do well, in some cases, they do better than the student that walked in first day. And we've got the research on this. I think we're going to see it just only get better, only expand.
SPEAKER_01We'll appreciate your thoughts on that and know that Lane has done tremendous work through the years on the past Lane program and the integrated education and training in the early childhood education area. And so to pair the foundational skills for students who may be working on their English proficiency or working towards a GED or just math writing reading skills along with the technical skills in early childhood that the work is contextualized, right? So they're learning the math skills, the language skills related to their field, which is more meaningful to students. So it's great to see Lane really embrace that and to hear directly from Christina how it's made a difference. And one last thing I wanted to add is you talked about earlier the credit for prior learning and recognizing that adults who come back to school at the college may be building certain skills, but they also have a ton of life experience. And so Christina's experience from work in this field, in the way that lane is configured, it really honors her skills, right? So she doesn't have to start over and take, let's say, that introductory class because she will be getting credit for prior learning based on the life experience that she has from her current and past work. And that is such a critical strategy and one that keeps students moving along towards their goal.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. You know, you could hear it in her voice. She felt honored that people were respecting the skills that she came with and using the new knowledge and skills she was gaining in her work experience. She's the typical adult learner who really just wants to be respected for what they bring to the table.
SPEAKER_01Absolutely. Well, and as you were talking about that Maslow's hierarchy of needs and recognizing many students are facing basic needs and security and focusing efforts there. I know that colleges can't do it all themselves. And part of our pathways to opportunity work is really about strong programs and inclusive policies, but also dynamic partnerships in the community. And so I'm wondering what some of those valuable community partnerships are that Lane Community College has developed that have really been most impactful in supporting students.
SPEAKER_00So so happy to talk about this because one of the things I've learned is not only being the college president, but in all my hats and all my roles, is you cannot do it by yourself, right? Even the traditional student needs partnerships at a community college. One of the first large-scale partnerships would be part of the OCCA, the Oregon Community College Association. So 17 community colleges. By partnering together, we went after funding in solidarity to have this program. And under President Mark Mitsui at PCC, he was very influential to OCC. So that was the first partnership. Then, of course, it's the whole social service network, right? You've got everybody from DHS, Food for Lane County, your SNAP programs, even like Social Security. Then you've got your employers, right? How important was it to Christina that she was hired? It was glorious to hear that excitement in her voice. Everything from Goodwill, Lane Workforce, the Oregon Employment Department, all working together to find out where's the gaps, where do we need employees, and what are the students looking for, and then matching it up. A lot of this is matchmaker work, right? And then there's this partnership with funding, funders, as I like to think of them. The foundation is our partner, right? The foundation is there to fill in the gaps where these other pieces do not fill in. But then there's a lot of public, private, and state donors out there that are looking for this type of a program to help students get out of what we call generational poverty and move up to the next level. And every single week, every month, we're finding new donors. So if you think about it, it's a shared case management experience where everybody becomes more aware of what everybody else is offering. So whoever's sitting in front of you and whatever you're helping them with, as you hear about additional needs, you can then pick up the phone to do a referral. Well, nowadays we zoom, I guess we zoom everybody. But you can do the referral and you can do that case management right on the spot. And I think this is amazing how sophisticated this is for Oregon. I'm just so honored to be a part of this.
SPEAKER_01That's really helpful to hear you describe the full ecosystem and all of these partners within colleges, out in the community, with employers, social service, and funders in philanthropy. And that really does build a whole support network for students and sort of come back to the navigator position. That ecosystem is complicated. So, even more reason than to have somebody who's helping students find and connect with funding through the foundation and with social services and connect with an employment opportunity in their field and all of that. So appreciate you touching on those partnerships and the importance there as we have committed to supporting students holistically. This All in Student Pathways Forward podcast was created to elevate student voices, to shape inclusive policies, programs, and partnerships. And I wanted to ask what are some ways that Lane Community College is also elevating student voices, particularly adult students, to shape policies and programs that do lead to student success?
SPEAKER_00So that's an interesting question because we do some very serious things to lift their voices, and then we kind of do some fun things too. So on a more serious note, we have a very good student government system. They have their own councils and president and committee work. And those students are active in pretty much everything we do. They even sometimes co-chair these college committees. Here in Oregon, our students are very integrated within the community college system and they have a voice. Now, on the more fun side, presidents and executives and directors, you know, we were all trying to figure out how do we know what's on a student's mind. So one of the things I did when I first came to Lane was something called P4, Pizza Pepsi, and popcorn with the president. It was a way for me, I always say, if you want people to come, have food, right? Fun food. So we went in the center building and by golly, it worked. I people were coming up, grabbing a slice of pizza, and sometimes I even had a line of people who wanted to tell me something. It was so good that when I did it the next time, I asked all of the uh executive leadership to come because sometimes they're asking me about the broken step or about how some piece of tuition was calculated. So then I thought, wow, we better have lots of resources in the room. And by golly, it works again. So now, if they wanted to talk to student services, there's somebody there. If they wanted to talk about the budget, we had somebody over there and they kind of work the route. And it was really glorious. So we did this until the pandemic hit, but there have been some virtual forums for the students. We've done that. The other thing I really love is the videos. Students do go online and they click videos. The more we can get students telling their story, like you're doing on the podcast, the better. Because students listen to students. You know, I'm actually learning from you how you did this podcast. I think it was really no, it's really good because you're hearing the students' lived experience, and then you're talking through what does it really mean? Like, what's it mean for Lane? How can we be a better Lane because of what we just heard?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, that's great to hear and understand. And I mean, you described the P4 as fun. To me, it seems like it's as important as the formal structures. It's also an informal way for students to have a conversation with you and your leadership team and in a setting that's not a board meeting, not formal committee meeting. And so that's awesome to hear, and also how you've thought about extending that as best as you can during COVID.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, one time, Mark, we were struggling with uh it was a budget, budget time of year, and we were struggling with uh, you know, do you put more money towards the housing like Titan Court? Do you put it in food service? You know, so here we were guessing, speculating, when we thought, well, wait a minute, let's let's take it to P4. So we put up a great big chart with uh color circles, and we had the students kind of like a scattergram, put the circle in their priorities. It was great. So anybody that walked through, and we could get up to 200 people at a time, we were able to see the scattergram of what they valued, what support services they valued. That was good. We will do that again because it was so successful.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, that's a great example and a wonderful activity, really engage with students to help prioritize where resources need to go. So as we wrap up, I just wanted to ask you if there's anything else you'd like to share for this podcast episode.
SPEAKER_00Sure. I I think the most important thing to remember about pathways to opportunity is it is an equity program. It is. And it's what I call a people program. It is about people for people, and it's about whole persons. It's not just about math, and it's not just about early child care. It's about a whole person, a person who's a mother who takes care of a, you know, of either a child or a parent and has to get to work on time and have child care. No magic beans to being successful at a college. But PTO, I like to say it's the next best thing to do magic beans, because our folks, the people that work at the college, they care so much about these students because they see them as people, not just numbers in a chart. And a little shout out to some of our employees, because I know Rosa, who is Rosa Lopez, who is our faculty. I call her everything, but the coordinator, the coach, the navigator. I mean, you know, people like Rosa care so much. And the colleague Marcia that she works with. I think what we all want is to do it right. And what's on a House bill right now is House Bill 2835, which would require community colleges and universities to all have benefits navigators. I think that's the last thing I want to everybody remember that we can even do better now if we have these navigators at every single college. And then if we have these navigators work together, wow, not only how fabulous it is that they're at your school working with your whole community and social services, but imagine if Lane talks to Portland, talks to Umpqua, right? Glackamas, we all talk together in a consortium. And then that last piece that you actually highlighted today, which is, and we listen to the student voices and we learn from those voices so that we can continuously make our program better. I just want to thank you for doing this and inviting me here today. It's just such a wonderful cause to talk about.
SPEAKER_01Well, I appreciate you taking the time to have this discussion and know you've been a champion of pathways to opportunity at Lane, but across the state. And I've learned a lot from our conversation and enjoyed chatting with you and listening to Christina. So thank you again for taking the time.
SPEAKER_00Thanks so much.
SPEAKER_01So our next guest is Judy Mortrude with World Education, and would like to welcome you, Judy, into the All-In Student Pathways Forward podcast today.
SPEAKER_04Thanks, Mark. Happy to be here.
SPEAKER_01So Judy is a senior technical advisor at World Education Incorporated and supports a range of national and state policy and professional learning initiatives. And Judy's expertise is really in career pathways system development, including integrated education and training, design and delivery, joint adult education and workforce development policy, and Shared accountability. And Judy has worked with colleges in Oregon through the years, providing technical assistance when she was at her former employer center for law and social policy clasp, and even in her current role in support of Oregon's Career Pathways Initiative, our work in integrated education and training, and the Pathways to Opportunity Initiative. So glad, Judy, you're you're very familiar with the work we've been doing in Oregon and think it's even more fitting to have you on the podcast then. It's great to be here. I'd love to just dive right in here and uh wanted to ask you if you could share more about your current and past work that connects adult education students with career pathways from your time at WorldEd Clasp and even back in Minnesota and how this all supports community college's focus on equity and student success.
SPEAKER_04Sure. Well, I will start back there in Minnesota because that's really when I came to know some of the early Oregon career pathway work. I have been in adult education, also secondary and post-secondary education for decades in the early 2000s, as Oregon and many states were experimenting with what later came to be called the adult career pathway movement, but we called it a lot of different things then bridges and uh transition models. I was working to help redesign uh systems to accelerate adult education through integrated instructional models. Started looking around a lot of emphasis on moving from professional wisdom to looking at data at that time. And we were looking at where were we transitioning our adult learners, looking at our local community college system, seeing things like 7% completion rates at our local systems? And of course, that was iPad's data. So that was first-time full-time students, not even a typical adult education learner. And then at our own system and adult ed, you know, what was completion of adult education, other than perhaps finishing that GED or uh that high school equivalency? How were we actually building these connected, integrated systems? From the Minnesota work, I moved to, as you said, CLASP and the Alliance for Quality Career Pathways. Oregon was one of those original 10 states in the Alliance, really a peer learning network of educators. When the Workforce Innovation Opportunity Act, when WIOA passed in 2014, the Alliance pivoted to WIOA implementation. And the reason why was because WIOA introduced for the first time a federal definition of career pathway, the career pathway program and service delivery model, that seven-part definition, which uh now, through a lot of advocacy of uh national educational advocates, is the same definition that is in the Perkins Strengthening Career and Technical Education for the 21st Century, Perkins 5, and in the Higher Education Act. And now at World Education, I work at one of our centers of expertise, is the National College Transition Network. And I do a lot of work around dual enrollment, dual enrollment between adult education and community college. Again, another evidence-based strategy, really well documented of how well dual enrollment helps high school students graduate from high school at higher rates, earn college credits at higher rates, complete college at higher rates. So if it works so well for 15 and 16-year-olds, you know, why not for their aunts and uncles and moms? Really is an equity imperative. Especially as in this time when we're having a lot of conversation around free college. But we all know that access doesn't equal success without some serious reform and without some serious partnership.
SPEAKER_01Yet I think back to some of the national grants that supported integrated education and training, like accelerating opportunity and learning that at the time Oregon was one of only 10 to 15 states that has adult education embedded in the community college system, and how advantageous that is to build out that model that can help accelerate that learning and connect it to college credentials leading to job opportunities, and know that the Alliance for Quality Career Pathways really helped Oregon continue to shape and solidify our work in this space.
SPEAKER_04I think Oregon was always the leader in the whole career pathway navigator space as well. And now we, you know, navigation and career navigators, digital navigators, this idea that yes, we we need to streamline our systems, but even when we do that, our systems are complicated and complex. And having a guide to help people find their way through them is really powerful.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, for sure. I was just looking at one of our TACT grants during the Obama administration and seeing the completion numbers for students that received that navigation, career coaching support, and were in a cohort, you know, it was 90 plus percent completion rate. And we had about 20% of all the students across all 17 colleges enrolling students in career pathways that were adult ed students. So we saw really interesting outcomes and success of students in adult ed who were gaining college credentials, gaining college credits on that path to further education.
SPEAKER_04That's so interesting that you bring up the TAC grants because the TAC grants also taught us a lot, like accelerating opportunities, like that early work that states were doing under these philanthropic investments. They taught us a lot about integrated education and training. They taught us a lot about these strategies that then got baked into WIOA when it passed. And yet we still see a lot of inertia in the WIOA system and people not pivoting to take advantage and use the resources for those more innovative models. It's only been six years since WiOA passed. But in a lot of ways, we haven't even turned on the most powerful levers that WIOA brought us.
SPEAKER_01We know from data that we've gathered that there are approximately 280,000 residents 25 and older in our state without a high school equivalency, and about 178,000 residents, 18 to 64 in Oregon, who identify as speaking English at a level less than very well. And meanwhile, we know that immigrants and those without a high school equivalency have really been disproportionately impacted by the pandemic and the current recession, as well as communities of color and women and low-wage workers. So curious from your national perspective and expertise, what are some key strategies colleges can take now to prioritize and best support students who begin their academic pathways in GED preparation andor English language coursework, and particularly through that lens of integrated education and training, which pairs the adult ed foundational skills with career technical education, leading to a college credential.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, exactly. I mean, IET is that dual enrollment strategy for adult learners, and it really is dual enrollment between the adult education system and the post-secondary education system, which, as you said, in Oregon, you know, luckily you've got those two systems under one roof. We have very solid research that shows us if we can use the adult education system as a supplemental academic instruction system, not a CASIS test level gain system, but really turn the adult education system into that integrated foundational support for the career technical education that people want. One of the keys that helped us get programs like iBest in Washington State and IT around the country was ability to benefit, which allows somebody without a high school completion to start accessing federal student aid, accessing Pell grants again to support that dual enrollment strategy, simultaneously working on completing that high school credential and that post-secondary credential. There are now four states that have put in statewide initiatives to support ability to benefit dual enrollment programs between adult education and their community colleges. So I'm hoping we're going to see more traction.
SPEAKER_01One of the takeaways I had from when I visited some programs up in Washington state, was even for schools that may have been smaller and didn't have, you know, 10 or 15 adult ed students that were interested in, say, healthcare or manufacturing or whatever that program was, there were other students that were enrolling in the IET IBES program, including developmental ed students and even traditional career technical ed students, and all of them were benefiting from that additional support.
SPEAKER_04Absolutely. Absolutely. I think one of those things that happens when something actually, like a great idea, makes it into federal law is that suddenly there's regulation around it, and then people forget that you're not doing this because the government tells you to because it's in the law. You're doing it because it's a great strategy that works. What we bring to it in adult education is an understanding of how to scaffold learning, how to do that just in time skill building, supplemental academic instruction, right? How to continually take the temperature in the room to see who's getting it and who's not, and then um, you know, differentiate instruction to make sure everybody comes along. Building back from those CTE courses rather than building up from the ELL or GED courses is where we see more momentum. I would just throw in here the guided pathways, right? And so we spent a lot of time in the early 2000s with career pathways. Uh, guided pathways has become another reform strategy. I call it like an intra-institutional reform strategy. Interestingly, some of the same researchers who brought us a career pathway way back when were at the forefront of the guided pathway. And I think the way I try to talk about the two strategies together is if you have a college going through a guided pathway reform, they're really becoming a better partner for an adult career pathway reform, right? They're helping people get defining those paths, clarifying the paths, helping people stay on the path. But often what I've seen across the country is that people in the community colleges spend a lot of time thinking about that in terms of transfer and connection to the four-year, which is great, but they forget to think about their adult ed partner and adult education being all adult learners being somewhere on those paths and having to clarify that path for someone who's starting in an English language class, in a GD class, build the whole spectrum, build the whole pipeline.
SPEAKER_01Absolutely. And when we look at the numbers of adults that could benefit from post-secondary credentials relative to traditional high school graduates, it's you know 448,000 adults, 25 and older, who were working, making 15 an hour less or not working. And it would take nine years of high school graduates to get to the same numbers. So it's not designing guided pathways for a small number of adults that could benefit. It's it's a significant number of prospective students that also need guidance and support through these new pathways or education focus areas, however, colleges are identifying them. I think that's a really good point, and it does feel like the guided pathways model is, as you said, built on the success of career pathways.
SPEAKER_04I listened to the interview with Christina from Lane Community College, and I was really struck. You asked her about her IET experience, and she said something about, yeah, somebody had said to her as she was going into a course that it was IET, and she was not sure what that really was or whether she needed that extra class. But she came to recognize, right, that that program design, that program delivery model proved to be really powerful for her, right? She really excelled, obviously built a lot of confidence and motivation, uh, seeing herself as a college student. A lot of times as we get into these terms of art for system redesign, I think it's good for us to remember we don't have to name these things for the students, right? We just need to do it.
SPEAKER_01Mm-hmm. And then guide our students through these through these systems. This has been a great conversation and appreciate you sharing your thoughts and insights and expertise. Is there anything else you'd want to share before we wrap up here?
SPEAKER_04Uh, you know, I just say that uh Oregon has been one of the leading states in the adult career pathway space for many years. And I think as new strategies, new initiatives, different investments come along and turn people's energy goes to different places. But I think that the adult career pathway through line is clear, even as you talk about some of these other reforms. And I'm just so glad you're doing this podcast and helping people see that through line.
SPEAKER_01Thank you for sharing your expertise here and as well through the years as we've continued to evolve our adult career pathways initiative and know that your technical assistance and input and guidance has really moved us in a very positive direction across the state and all 17 of our community colleges in different ways. So glad that we are connected with you. And so just want to thank you for taking the time to have this conversation for the podcast.
SPEAKER_04Sure, thanks.
SPEAKER_01That'll do it for this episode of All In Student Pathways Forward. I'll be back in a few weeks with Dre Aguide, a student from Central Oregon Community College, a follow-up discussion with some leaders there at COCC, and wrap up with a conversation with Bree Wynn and Natasha Bennett from Seattle Jobs Initiative, SJI, on their work nationally and in Oregon on student centered design. Thanks again for listening in. This is Mark Goldberg, the host, and we will see you the next time.